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Post by pippsheadache on May 6, 2019 15:02:50 GMT -5
Me too. I had him as one of the top three Yankee second basemen ever -- the others being HOFers Tony Lazzeri and Joe Gordon -- and the best I personally had seen. Another guy who almost certainly didn't need the PEDs to be great. But now there will always be that taint. It's just sad. I actually had him ahead of Joe Gordon...But not “Poosh ‘em up, Tony”!!! I kept changing my order, depending on which abstruse stat caught my attention that day. We have reached a point in baseball where we have to determine the value not just of players, but of the stats we use to compare them. |
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Post by inger on May 6, 2019 15:09:56 GMT -5
Finished! All the gravel I needed to move into the front yard is now officially in place. The landscaping project also will include putting medium sized rocks in place, a bit of lawn edging, and a new front walkway, so there is plenty more to do here at the shanty.
But what a relief to be done with the shovel, wheel, dump, take routine...I took today off to finish that portion because they’re calling for rain here for the next four days. We could get anything from a drizzle to several downpours. You never know in the desert...We’ll take what ever we get. It could be months before we get more...Rain, I mean...
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Post by inger on May 6, 2019 15:14:03 GMT -5
I actually had him ahead of Joe Gordon...But not “Poosh ‘em up, Tony”!!! I kept changing my order, depending on which abstruse stat caught my attention that day. We have reached a point in baseball where we have to determine the value not just of players, but of the stats we use to compare them. I think we’re over-statisticalized, if that’s a real word. The one I feel the most comfortable with when comparing multiple eras is OPS+, but you still have to have a feel for fielding talent, which also must be compared to players from the same era to allow for equipment and field conditions... |
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Post by inger on May 6, 2019 15:24:19 GMT -5
For the record, Lazzeri had an OPS+ of 121, Gordon 120, and the current chemically-bolstered number for Cano is 126 and falling...
I lend a lot of credence to Lazzeri finishing third behind Ruth and Gehrig in HR in 1927 with a modest sounding 18. Most likely, from the tales I’ve heard and the books I’ve read, my gut tells me Gordon was the best fielder of the three. It’s close.
I now rank them as Lazzeri, Gordon, Cano...I’m still not sure why the fielding metrics are so unkind to Cano, but I know there have been better fielding 2B than him...
BTW, despite what we’ve seen, Fan Graphs is not being particularly good to Urshela this far in 2019. This is being blamed on small sample size by some of the analysts, but what a sample I’ve seen!!!
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Post by chiyankee on May 6, 2019 16:41:33 GMT -5
Finished! All the gravel I needed to move into the front yard is now officially in place. The landscaping project also will include putting medium sized rocks in place, a bit of lawn edging, and a new front walkway, so there is plenty more to do here at the shanty. But what a relief to be done with the shovel, wheel, dump, take routine...I took today off to finish that portion because they’re calling for rain here for the next four days. We could get anything from a drizzle to several downpours. You never know in the desert...We’ll take what ever we get. It could be months before we get more...Rain, I mean... Sounds like you need to kick back, have a beer and watch a Yankee game! |
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Post by anthonyd46 on May 6, 2019 16:53:33 GMT -5
According to the Yankees twitter they haven't lost a season series vs the mariners since 2003. The Yankees lead the twins 2-1 so far this year and they haven't lost to them in a season series since 2001. I always knew about the twins but never knew the mariners had a similar streak.
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Post by pippsheadache on May 6, 2019 17:06:05 GMT -5
I kept changing my order, depending on which abstruse stat caught my attention that day. We have reached a point in baseball where we have to determine the value not just of players, but of the stats we use to compare them. I think we’re over-statisticalized, if that’s a real word. The one I feel the most comfortable with when comparing multiple eras is OPS+, but you still have to have a feel for fielding talent, which also must be compared to players from the same era to allow for equipment and field conditions... It's impossible to fairly compare players without statistics. But it is also impossible to fully evaluate flesh and blood athletes without some recourse to eyewitness accounts, either our own or those of knowledgeable witnesses. There is also an element of common sense. I realize that OBP is only one element of evaluation, but it's definitely one of the most important. Still, if the game was on the line in the ninth inning, and the bases were loaded with two out, which of these players would you most want up at bat? Assuming maximal batter-pitcher matchups in each case. Nick Johnson, who has the highest OBP of the group, or any of the following in descending OBP order (among many others who I left out)? Joe DiMaggio, Johnny Mize, Miguel Cabrera, Rod Carew, Joe Morgan, Honus Wagner, Frank Robinson, Tony Gwynn, Joe Mauer, Tim Raines, Willie Mays, Bill Dickey, Mike Schmidt, Tony Lazzeri, Al Simmons, David Ortiz, Vlad Guerrero (Sr., of course), Dick Allen, Derek Jeter, Mike Piazza, Al Kaline, Willie McCovey or, way at the bottom of this list, Hank Aaron? Okay, there are tons of variables in there, and to some extent I am playing games, I get that. And just maybe Nick Johnson actually is the guy who should be up there. But he would be last on my list out of that group. You can make similar arguments about Bobby Abreu. If you look at a lot of key stats, you can make the case that he was a Hall of Fame player. But nobody who actually ever saw him would regard him that way. I realize we have to have meaningful stats to make any evaluations at all. I use them constantly to compare players. But I do think the eye test counts for something, although it is admittedly not quantifiable. The game would not be much fun if it were that cut and dried. |
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Post by rizzuto on May 6, 2019 17:14:13 GMT -5
I think we’re over-statisticalized, if that’s a real word. The one I feel the most comfortable with when comparing multiple eras is OPS+, but you still have to have a feel for fielding talent, which also must be compared to players from the same era to allow for equipment and field conditions... It's impossible to fairly compare players without statistics. But it is also impossible to fully evaluate flesh and blood athletes without some recourse to eyewitness accounts, either our own or those of knowledgeable witnesses. There is also an element of common sense. I realize that OBP is only one element of evaluation, but it's definitely one of the most important. Still, if the game was on the line in the ninth inning, and the bases were loaded with two out, which of these players would you most want up at bat? Assuming maximal batter-pitcher matchups in each case. Nick Johnson, who has the highest OBP of the group, or any of the following in descending OBP order (among many others who I left out)? Joe DiMaggio, Johnny Mize, Miguel Cabrera, Rod Carew, Joe Morgan, Honus Wagner, Frank Robinson, Tony Gwynn, Joe Mauer, Tim Raines, Willie Mays, Bill Dickey, Mike Schmidt, Tony Lazzeri, Al Simmons, David Ortiz, Vlad Guerrero (Sr., of course), Dick Allen, Derek Jeter, Mike Piazza, Al Kaline, Willie McCovey or, way at the bottom of this list, Hank Aaron? Okay, there are tons of variables in there, and to some extent I am playing games, I get that. And just maybe Nick Johnson actually is the guy who should be up there. But he would be last on my list out of that group. You can make similar arguments about Bobby Abreu. If you look at a lot of key stats, you can make the case that he was a Hall of Fame player. But nobody who actually ever saw him would regard him that way. I realize we have to have meaningful stats to make any evaluations at all. I use them constantly to compare players. But I do think the eye test counts for something, although it is admittedly not quantifiable. The game would not be much fun if it were that cut and dried. Joe DiMaggio. One of my Yankee buddies in his eighties used to listen to games on the radio. With the game on the line and DiMaggio up, he would think, “He cannot do this again. The probability must be against him.” Then, unbelievably, DiMaggio would come through in the clutch, again. |
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Post by rizzuto on May 6, 2019 17:18:13 GMT -5
By the way, Joe DiMaggio’s career line as a pinch hitter: .462/.533/.923/1.456
With two outs and runners in scoring position: .338/.437/.648/1.085
Batting in the ninth inning: .360/.436/.691/1.127
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Post by inger on May 6, 2019 17:59:18 GMT -5
Nice to see Voit smashed one before I got back from the grocery store. His bat had grown a bit quiet for a few days...This year’s version of King Felix has looked a bit better than last year’s version so far. Sting him early, just in case...
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Post by inger on May 6, 2019 18:03:58 GMT -5
Estrada hits a la-de-dah-da!!!
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Post by inger on May 6, 2019 18:10:03 GMT -5
By the way, Joe DiMaggio’s career line as a pinch hitter: .462/.533/.923/1.456 With two outs and runners in scoring position: .338/.437/.648/1.085 Batting in the ninth inning: .360/.436/.691/1.127 Those are some big-ass numbers. I’m pretty much sold... I admit that I wasn’t as impressed with DiMag as a young boy. That had to do with just looking at the career numbers and not wanting to believe he could be better than Mantle. At ten years of age, I wasn’t aware of what it meant that he lost prime years to WW2. I wasn’t thinking about how he retired younger than most would have. I also wasn’t aware of how he had grabbed THE single prize of femininity in his generation... Mantle might have had a blond on each arm every night, but he didn’t have THAT blond... |
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Post by rizzuto on May 6, 2019 18:14:24 GMT -5
Nice to see Voit smashed one before I got back from the grocery store. His bat had grown a bit quiet for a few days...This year’s version of King Felix has looked a bit better than last year’s version so far. Sting him early, just in case... I thought that today might be a good day off for him to clear his head. Then, I saw that Hernandez was pitching, and I thought, that mediocre fastball might just fix what ails him! |
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Post by rizzuto on May 6, 2019 18:19:34 GMT -5
By the way, Joe DiMaggio’s career line as a pinch hitter: .462/.533/.923/1.456 With two outs and runners in scoring position: .338/.437/.648/1.085 Batting in the ninth inning: .360/.436/.691/1.127 Those are some big-ass numbers. I’m pretty much sold... I admit that I wasn’t as impressed with DiMag as a young boy. That had to do with just looking at the career numbers and not wanting to believe he could be better than Mantle. At ten years of age, I wasn’t aware of what it meant that he lost prime years to WW2. I wasn’t thinking about how he retired younger than most would have. I also wasn’t aware of how he had grabbed THE single prize of femininity in his generation... Mantle might have had a blond on each arm every night, but he didn’t have THAT blond... I grew up hearing about Mantle from one of my older brothers, but the old guys talked about DiMaggio, who they said had no weaknesses, other than being right-handed in a stadium with a 462-foot left centerfield fence. That was the real “ Death Valley.” |
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Post by inger on May 6, 2019 18:21:25 GMT -5
Nice to see Voit smashed one before I got back from the grocery store. His bat had grown a bit quiet for a few days...This year’s version of King Felix has looked a bit better than last year’s version so far. Sting him early, just in case... I thought that today might be a good day off for him to clear his head. Then, I saw that Hernandez was pitching, and I thought, that mediocre fastball might just fix what ails him! It’s like clear my head, hell! Let me at him!!! |
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