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Post by utahyank on Aug 14, 2019 15:19:49 GMT -5
was the guy who walked with a limp a Deputy Marshall as well?...or just called a deputy? Chester was more of an aide de camp. Only deputized and wore a badge on specific occasions. Oh, OK....couldn't think of Chester's name....the guy who played the town doctor seemed to be the most level-headed one in the town....even Matt could get off-kilter at times..... |
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Post by noetsi on Aug 14, 2019 15:24:17 GMT -5
I was thinking of some of the classic Westerns. One of the best was Gunsmoke. But for reasons I never understood they made the lead a deputy marshal although he clearly served as the town marshal. Deputy Marshals dealt with federal law not state law generally and were most used in the Indian territories (modern Oklahoma primarily) where local law was scarce. Matt Dillion’s character was a United States Marshall. Festus was a Deputy Marshall. Marshalls hired their own deputies. He needed a deputy because he was always out of town, which is why at the beginning of most episodes Matt was either leaving Dodge or just coming back. You are right he was a federal marshal not a deputy marshal, but federal marshals did not as he does throughout the show enforce state and local laws. The towns hired their own law enforcement people who were not in the federal service (nor were sheriffs who enforced county laws). During the show very little of the issues he is involved in are federal in nature.
Dodge City had a wide range of famous law enforcement people including Bat Masterson. www.kansashistory.us/fordco/lawmen.html Probably would have been upset if federal officers had been involved  But as far as I know federal civilian law enforcement was not effected by the Posse Comitatus Act so unlike the army they could get involved in local law enforcement and sometimes did.
The US army was briefly involved in the Lincoln County war that Billy the Kid was involved in. But the commanding officer probably should not have legally done that and was eventually court martialed.
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Post by rizzuto on Aug 14, 2019 15:27:03 GMT -5
Chester was more of an aide de camp. Only deputized and wore a badge on specific occasions. Oh, OK....couldn't think of Chester's name....the guy who played the town doctor seemed to be the most level-headed one in the town....even Matt could get off-kilter at times..... Doc Adams was also the most humorous of the characters, as well. There was one episode in which Doc was prepared to throw everything away to kill a man from his past. Even had an old pistol ready for the deed. James Arness 6”7” won a bronze star and Purple Heart in WWII at the Battle of Anzio. |
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Post by rizzuto on Aug 14, 2019 15:45:30 GMT -5
Matt Dillion’s character was a United States Marshall. Festus was a Deputy Marshall. Marshalls hired their own deputies. He needed a deputy because he was always out of town, which is why at the beginning of most episodes Matt was either leaving Dodge or just coming back. You are right he was a federal marshal not a deputy marshal, but federal marshals did not as he does throughout the show enforce state and local laws. The towns hired their own law enforcement people who were not in the federal service (nor were sheriffs who enforced county laws). During the show very little of the issues he is involved in are federal in nature.
Dodge City had a wide range of famous law enforcement people including Bat Masterson. www.kansashistory.us/fordco/lawmen.html Probably would have been upset if federal officers had been involved But as far as I know federal civilian law enforcement was not effected by the Posse Comitatus Act so unlike the army they could get involved in local law enforcement and sometimes did.
The US army was briefly involved in the Lincoln County war that Billy the Kid was involved in. But the commanding officer probably should not have legally done that and was eventually court martialed.
Wrong again. Since he was in charge of a U.S. region consisting of states and territories with scarce law enforcement, of course he would assist to enforce state and local laws, especially where he was based. Simply because he was a federal employee didn’t necessitate that he blindly ignore crime and fail to keep the peace, especially with no local sheriff or magistrate. Bank robberies, railroad hold ups, federal bounties, gold shipments, executions, stage robberies, gangs....these were common enough to the plots and interfered with interstate commerce, mail, federal warrants, capital crimes, etc. And, Dillon always discouraged posses, distrustful of mob mentality. Did you even watch the show? Or, did you mute it as well? |
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Post by noetsi on Aug 14, 2019 16:02:02 GMT -5
While at times marshals were involved in local matters that was not their primary role and they would have come into conflict with local law enforcement had they done so in populated area at a time when law enforcement was highly political. "During the settlement of the American Frontier, marshals served as the main source of day-to-day law enforcement in areas that had no local government of their own."[8] en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Marshals_Service"Generally speaking, U.S. marshals and their deputies dealt with federal issues. The town marshals and their deputies acted as peace officers in the towns." truewestmagazine.com/whats-the-difference-between-an-old-west-marshal-and-a-sheriff/Sometimes the situation could get confusing. For instance at the OK Corral Virgil Earp was both a town marshal and a us deputy marshal. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virgil_Earp |
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Post by inger on Aug 14, 2019 17:14:06 GMT -5
From an historical perspective what Gunsmoke was was one of the greatest action-adventure tv shows ever. It even sprinkled in a bit of light comedy and heart-warming moments. It’s historical accuracy is unimportant.
I’ve seen pictures of Gunsmoke scenes where tracks had been left in the street from inflatable rubber tires. Do I care? No. It was great. I’ve taken to watching an episode or two late at night of late...
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Post by noetsi on Aug 14, 2019 17:27:16 GMT -5
This is a history thread not a Hollywood thread I understand Hollywood commonly ignore history (although the radio program it was based on was a very serious Western and the tv show followed this at first). My real point is that there was no need to make him a federal marshal. They could have just as easily made him a town marshal. Its puzzling they chose to do what they did. Federal marshals (as compared to deputy marshals) were administrators who dealt with a lot of stuff, for example in the courts, payrolls, politics, etc. |
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Post by inger on Aug 14, 2019 18:26:37 GMT -5
This is a history thread not a Hollywood thread I understand Hollywood commonly ignore history (although the radio program it was based on was a very serious Western and the tv show followed this at first). My real point is that there was no need to make him a federal marshal. They could have just as easily made him a town marshal. Its puzzling they chose to do what they did. Federal marshals (as compared to deputy marshals) were administrators who dealt with a lot of stuff, for example in the courts, payrolls, politics, etc. Your point is multi-faceted. Why should we even be discussing historical accuracy of a TV show in a history thread? To me, it appears you have steered your own thread off topic...Unless you intended to discuss the historical accuracy of fictional characters. That would be a bit bizarre, even by your standards... |
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Post by noetsi on Aug 14, 2019 18:38:43 GMT -5
Well there are history channels that do fact and fiction to look at widely held views and determine if they are accurate. And when there was a history channel they used to show historical movies and critique them.
This is what this thread is doing so far. Showing the popular image of Hollywood, which has had real political and social impact, and the reality is useful
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Post by noetsi on Aug 17, 2019 18:49:52 GMT -5
Speaking of history how about the fact there was a 1903 WS, one in 1905 but none in 1904 because the team that won the NL refused to play the AL that year In 1919 and 1921 it took 5 games to win, the series last 8 games both years (I am not sure when the rule was changed to winning 4 games). |
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