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Post by ypaterson on Mar 14, 2024 13:31:57 GMT -5
I didn't say that he had top of the rotation stuff based on 1 season. A stretch would be how you just asked and then answered your own question with another question. Well he has had only one season so far in his career that he pitched like a top of the rotation pitcher . I mean the other two full seasons he was more like monty who people here say is a number starter at best . You said yourself that “ there is no argument that he has top of the rotation stuff” what exactly is that supposed to mean if you are now saying you never said that he has top of the rotation stuff? Cease and Monty are comparable with Cease being a couple of years younger. Both are solid starters but not in the Cole tier. |
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Post by posadafan24 on Mar 14, 2024 13:35:53 GMT -5
Well he has had only one season so far in his career that he pitched like a top of the rotation pitcher . I mean the other two full seasons he was more like monty who people here say is a number starter at best . You said yourself that “ there is no argument that he has top of the rotation stuff” what exactly is that supposed to mean if you are now saying you never said that he has top of the rotation stuff? Cease and Monty are comparable with Cease being a couple of years younger. Both are solid starters but not in the Cole tier. Neither are top of the rotation pitchers either . |
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Post by ypaterson on Mar 14, 2024 13:36:11 GMT -5
You can never count on a prospect panning out....Or a pitcher's health. I am sure the Rangers and the Red Sox can attest to that. What is true is that if Jones proves himself you get 6 years of control. Trade him for Burnes or Soto or any other rental and the best you get is 1 year. And you really think its worth wasting whatever prime years judge and cole have left to find out if one guy will pan out? In the case of Jones....YES. He might have 54 home runs a year power playing half his games in Yankee Stadium. My general rule is the Yankees should always give left handed power a chance to show what they can do at the MLB level. |
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 13:50:02 GMT -5
You can never count on a prospect panning out....Or a pitcher's health. I am sure the Rangers and the Red Sox can attest to that. What is true is that if Jones proves himself you get 6 years of control. Trade him for Burnes or Soto or any other rental and the best you get is 1 year. And you really think its worth wasting whatever prime years judge and cole have left to find out if one guy will pan out?
That would be a poor excuse to make trades that would likely mortgage the Yankees future. The Yankees have a good team, they aren't wasting Judge's and Cole's prime years. Your logic would lead the Yankees into making panic trades/panic signings.
Burnes, a likely 1 season rental, would have cost the Yankees... Jones, Hampton or Warren, plus.
As with prospects, judging by past players that have played for the Yankees there's also a question if Burnes would "pan out" playing for the Yankees.
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 13:53:11 GMT -5
I also wanted to comment on this argument you use all the time. "he hasn't proven a thing". I guess I'm not even sure what that means. I think he's proven he's a good prospect based upon his play at the college level and so far in his minor league career. We can compare his growth against mlb players at this point in his career and make projections. Does that mean he's going to be a star, absolutely not, but every star was a prospect at some point. If your definition of proving oneself is success at the mlb level then I guess you have devalued every prospect in our organization, we might as well trade them all for whatever we can get. College is not the minors and he only has about one season in the minors . And that one full season wasnt that impressive either . Thats hardly a proven talent . I guess Iit doesnt take much for you to buy into the hype . Burnes pitching in Milwakee isn't him pitching in NYC for the NY Yankees. |
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 13:57:09 GMT -5
Well he has had only one season so far in his career that he pitched like a top of the rotation pitcher . I mean the other two full seasons he was more like monty who people here say is a number starter at best . You said yourself that “ there is no argument that he has top of the rotation stuff” what exactly is that supposed to mean if you are now saying you never said that he has top of the rotation stuff? Cease and Monty are comparable with Cease being a couple of years younger. Both are solid starters but not in the Cole tier. Cole's an Ace. Not many pitchers are in Cole's tier. That's one reason why I said that Cease has top of the rotation stuff with the potential to be an Ace. |
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 14:04:09 GMT -5
Cease and Monty are comparable with Cease being a couple of years younger. Both are solid starters but not in the Cole tier. Neither are top of the rotation pitchers either . Cease has top of the rotation stuff, with the potential to be an Ace.
Do you think that the Padres they got fleeced for Cease, by trading 3 of their top 8 prospects for in your words a "very good number 3 starter"? |
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Post by posadafan24 on Mar 14, 2024 14:10:35 GMT -5
And you really think its worth wasting whatever prime years judge and cole have left to find out if one guy will pan out? In the case of Jones....YES. He might have 54 home runs a year power playing half his games in Yankee Stadium. My general rule is the Yankees should always give left handed power a chance to show what they can do at the MLB level. Well thats not how you win a ws . You win it by making the necessary moves needed to build a serious ws contender . Waiting on prospects for the last 6 plus years is why this team has so many holes in it . |
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Post by posadafan24 on Mar 14, 2024 14:11:47 GMT -5
And you really think its worth wasting whatever prime years judge and cole have left to find out if one guy will pan out?
That would be a poor excuse to make trades that would likely mortgage the Yankees future. The Yankees have a good team, they aren't wasting Judge's and Cole's prime years. Your logic would lead the Yankees into making panic trades/panic signings.
Burnes, a likely 1 season rental, would have cost the Yankees... Jones, Hampton or Warren, plus.
As with prospects, judging by past players that have played for the Yankees there's also a question if Burnes would "pan out" playing for the Yankees.
Yeah they are since in the last 6 years the only thing they have to show is one division title and having the worst record in 30 years but i guess thats acceptable all in the name of prospect hugging right ? Heck judge hit 62 hrs in 22 , what did that get them? Oh yeah swept by the astros in humiliating fashion . Talk about wasting talent |
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Post by posadafan24 on Mar 14, 2024 14:13:15 GMT -5
Cease and Monty are comparable with Cease being a couple of years younger. Both are solid starters but not in the Cole tier. Cole's an Ace. Not many pitchers are in Cole's tier. That's one reason why I said that Cease has top of the rotation stuff with the potential to be an Ace. Top of the rotation stuff is a number 1 or 2 starter , and cease hasnt proven that he is that so far . |
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Post by posadafan24 on Mar 14, 2024 14:14:32 GMT -5
Neither are top of the rotation pitchers either . Cease has top of the rotation stuff, with the potential to be an Ace.
Do you think that the Padres they got fleeced for Cease, by trading 3 of their top 8 prospects for in your words a "very good number 3 starter"? I think they paid a steep price They gave a bunch of top prospects for for a guy thats like monty , especially since he is a 2 year rental . |
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 14:43:08 GMT -5
And you really think its worth wasting whatever prime years judge and cole have left to find out if one guy will pan out? In the case of Jones....YES. He might have 54 home runs a year power playing half his games in Yankee Stadium. My general rule is the Yankees should always give left handed power a chance to show what they can do at the MLB level.
In my opinion, the same should apply for lefty pitching. I remember Gene Michael in interviews stressing lefty pitching, lefty power. |
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 14:58:54 GMT -5
That would be a poor excuse to make trades that would likely mortgage the Yankees future. The Yankees have a good team, they aren't wasting Judge's and Cole's prime years. Your logic would lead the Yankees into making panic trades/panic signings.
Burnes, a likely 1 season rental, would have cost the Yankees... Jones, Hampton or Warren, plus.
As with prospects, judging by past players that have played for the Yankees there's also a question if Burnes would "pan out" playing for the Yankees.
Yeah they are since in the last 6 years the only thing they have to show is one division title and having the worst record in 30 years but i guess thats acceptable all in the name of prospect hugging right ? Heck judge hit 62 hrs in 22 , what did that get them? Oh yeah swept by the astros in humiliating fashion . Talk about wasting talent The Yankees have a very good record when adding up the last 6 years. For the most part they were serious contenders to have a chance at winning the world series. The Red Sox were better, and so were the Astros. That happens. The Astros spent a lot of years finishing with a poor record that allowed them build a very good team by "prospect hugging" many of their fielders.
Judge hitting 62 HRs helped get the Yankees into the playoffs. They beat Cleveland and lost to the Astros. Sometimes if not all of the time the other team deserves credit. Did all the other teams that didn't win the world series waste their players talent? Was keeping Judge prospect hugging? |
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 15:03:15 GMT -5
Cole's an Ace. Not many pitchers are in Cole's tier. That's one reason why I said that Cease has top of the rotation stuff with the potential to be an Ace. Top of the rotation stuff is a number 1 or 2 starter , and cease hasnt proven that he is that so far . His stats, his stuff, and the potential he's shown says otherwise. Including his swing and miss ratio that you haven't comment on. You know, Cease's swing and miss ratio that's right up there with Cole's and Burnes' swing and miss ratio. |
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Post by Max on Mar 14, 2024 15:12:57 GMT -5
Cease has top of the rotation stuff, with the potential to be an Ace.
Do you think that the Padres they got fleeced for Cease, by trading 3 of their top 8 prospects for in your words a "very good number 3 starter"? I think they paid a steep price They gave a bunch of top prospects for for a guy thats like monty , especially since he is a 2 year rental .
He's younger than Monty. Monty played for better teams, but Cease has a better winning % than Monty. Monty never finished 2nd in the Cy Young voting. You call him a 2 year rental. Burnes would likely have been a 1 year rental. Even if you think that Cease is a "very good number 3 starter" If the Padres "prospect hugged" and didn't make that trade...Wouldn't they be even closer to wasting Machado's, Bogaerts', Tatis', Kim's, King's, Musgrove's "prime years" than they would be without a "very good number 3 starter"?
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